Jacob Hilton

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Agreed. Likewise, in a transformer, the token dimension should maintain some relationship with the input and output tokens. This is sometimes taken for granted, but it is a good example of the data preferring a coordinate system. My remark that you quoted only really applies to the channel dimension, across which layers typically scramble everything.

The notion of a preferred (linear) transformation for interpretability has been called a "privileged basis" in the mechanistic interpretability literature. See for example Softmax Linear Units, where the idea is discussed at length.

In practice, the typical reason to expect a privileged basis is in fact SGD – or more precisely, the choice of architecture. Specifically, activation functions such as ReLU often privilege the standard basis. I would not generally expect the data or the initialization to privilege any basis beyond the start of the network or the start of training. The data may itself have a privileged basis, but this should be lost as soon as the first linear layer is reached. The initialization is usually Gaussian and hence isotropic anyway, but if it did have a privileged basis I would also expect this to be quickly lost without some other reason to hold onto it.

For people viewing on the Alignment Forum, there is a separate thread on this question here. (Edit: my link to LessWrong is automatically converted to an Alignment Forum link, you will have to navigate there yourself.)

Without commenting on the specifics, I have edited to the post to mitigate potential confusion: "this fact alone is not intended to provide a complete picture of the Anthropic split, which is more complicated than I am able to explain here".

I was the project lead on WebGPT and my motivation was to explore ideas for scalable oversight and truthfulness (some further explanation is given here).

It includes the people working on the kinds of projects I listed under the first misconception. It does not include people working on things like the mitigation you linked to. OpenAI distinguishes internally between research staff (who do ML and policy research) and applied staff (who work on commercial activities), and my numbers count only the former.

I don't think I understand your question about Y-problems, since it seems to depend entirely on how specific something can be and still count as a "problem". Obviously there is already experimental evidence that informs predictions about existential risk from AI in general, but we will get no experimental evidence of any exact situation that occurs beforehand. My claim was more of a vague impression about how OpenAI leadership and John tend to respond to different kinds of evidence in general, and I do not hold it strongly.

To clarify, by "empirical" I meant "relating to differences in predictions" as opposed to "relating to differences in values" (perhaps "epistemic" would have been better). I did not mean to distinguish between experimental versus conceptual evidence. I would expect OpenAI leadership to put more weight on experimental evidence than you, but to be responsive to evidence of all kinds. I think that OpenAI leadership are aware of most of the arguments you cite, but came to different conclusions after considering them than you did.

This is just supposed to be an (admittedly informal) restatement of the definition of outer alignment in the context of an objective function where the data distribution plays a central role.

For example, assuming a reinforcement learning objective function, outer alignment is equivalent to the statement that there is an aligned policy that gets higher average reward on the training distribution than any unaligned policy.

I did not intend to diminish the importance of robustness by focusing on outer alignment in this post.

I share your intuitions about ultimately not needing much alignment data (and tried to get that across in the post), but quantitatively:

  • Recent implementations of RLHF have used on the order of thousands of hours of human feedback, so 2 orders of magnitude more than that is much more than a few hundred hours of human feedback.
  • I think it's pretty likely that we'll be able to pay an alignment tax upwards of 1% of total training costs (essentially because people don't want to die), in which case we could afford to spend significantly more than an additional 2 orders of magnitude on alignment data, if that did in fact turn out to be required.
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